I await, now, the inevitable outcry over how the fact that Isaac’s desire to serve liquor at its North Queen Street location will destroy the moral fabric of our community.
And I love the insinuation that a restaurant can’t be “family friendly” if it dares to serve liquor. You know, it ain’t like drunks are lying on the floor of TGI Friday’s or Applebees, passed out in the booths, leering at children. You’d think that, though, the way we approach these things.
31 comments
Tags: Alcohol · Lancaster
| Lancaster 1/10/08 12:30 PM | QUOTE(Lancaster Online @ Jan 10 2008, 01:20 PM) [snapback]347997[/snapback] Post your thoughts and comments about this blog post. Why don't you just beg for it (the outcry) Gil???  |
| Hope 1/10/08 12:36 PM | Why do they think they need alcohol to remain competitive? I'm not against serving alcohol but I don't see the need for it there. |
| Alyssarah1 1/10/08 12:46 PM | They just want to be prepared for all those drunken conventioneers. |
| LicenseForMayhem 1/10/08 12:49 PM | Didn't the Red Rose get a liquor license? I don't remember a big hue and cry over that. Why would this be any different? |
| Hope 1/10/08 12:49 PM | QUOTE(Alyssarah1 @ Jan 10 2008, 12:46 PM) [snapback]348012[/snapback] They just want to be prepared for all those drunken conventioneers. you mean someone actually thinks they will show up?  |
| Shawn 1/10/08 1:42 PM | QUOTE(Hope @ Jan 10 2008, 12:36 PM) [snapback]348010[/snapback] Why do they think they need alcohol to remain competitive? I'm not against serving alcohol but I don't see the need for it there. Why is there a "need" for it anywhere? Why is that even a criteria? Why shouldn't I be allowed to drink a glass of wine or have a beer with my Mallard? Later...Shawn |
| dodgecrew 1/10/08 1:53 PM | QUOTE(Lancaster @ Jan 10 2008, 12:30 PM) [snapback]348008[/snapback] Why don't you just beg for it (the outcry) Gil??? I second this. I see no outcry from anyone out there. My wife and I do not drink alcohol. Yet there are many places that we have eaten at, and continue to go to that serve alcohol. Quite honestly, it means very little to us. We tend to go to places that have good food and good service. We are MUCH more concerned about walking out of a place smelling like cigarettes, then we are sitting next to someone that is drinking a beer...... |
| Hope 1/10/08 2:50 PM | QUOTE(Shawn @ Jan 10 2008, 01:42 PM) [snapback]348028[/snapback] Why is there a "need" for it anywhere? Why is that even a criteria? Why shouldn't I be allowed to drink a glass of wine or have a beer with my Mallard? Later...Shawn I think you may have misunderstood my question Shawn. I was asking why Issac's sees the "need" for it, not the consumer. You should be allowed to drink wine, beer or carrot juice with your Mallard if you like just as I am permitted to drink tea with my Eaglet but that isn't the point. Issac's has done so well without alcohol I was just wondering why the powers that be in there corporation want to make a change now... |
| Shawn 1/10/08 3:29 PM | QUOTE(Hope @ Jan 10 2008, 02:50 PM) [snapback]348046[/snapback] I think you may have misunderstood my question Shawn. I was asking why Issac's sees the "need" for it, not the consumer. You should be allowed to drink wine, beer or carrot juice with your Mallard if you like just as I am permitted to drink tea with my Eaglet but that isn't the point. Issac's has done so well without alcohol I was just wondering why the powers that be in there corporation want to make a change now... My guess is one of two things. Or a combination of both. First, it is an added revenue stream. I'm sure they are doing well, but if they see a way to make more money, they should obviously pursue it. Thats what successful businesses do. Second, perhaps the customers themselves have been requesting it, and they feel they could get more customers by offering alcohol, or get the customers they do get to spend more money, thus raising their per/customer average profit. I'm sure the bottom line is the bottom line. They've done an analysis and determined they can make more money by offering alcohol. Later...Shawn |
| solitary 1/10/08 3:39 PM | QUOTE(Alyssarah1 @ Jan 10 2008, 12:46 PM) [snapback]348012[/snapback] They just want to be prepared for all those drunken conventioneers. I think that's it in a nutshell.Don't go to the pizza place for a beer (I mean it, don't). Come to Isaac's instead. QUOTE(Shawn @ Jan 10 2008, 01:42 PM) [snapback]348028[/snapback] Why is there a "need" for it anywhere? Why is that even a criteria? Why shouldn't I be allowed to drink a glass of wine or have a beer with my Mallard? I'd still like to know why you need to get a liquor license period. Oh, yes, now I remember. Penn was a puritanical tyrant. Or at least that's what we like to think.Later...Shawn Grocery store: no beer for you. Wine's ok, but you need to add so much salt that it's worthless. Beer distributor: beer ok, no liquor, by the case or keg only. Liquor store: cause the state knows how to sell the hard stuff better than anybody. Bar: sell anything you like, as long as you pony up a few grand to do it. Except only two six packs per customer. They can drink a 1/5 while they're there, but can't take more than two six packs out. And no buckets o' beer either. Drunk drivers obey the closed container law, don't cha know? QUOTE(Hope @ Jan 10 2008, 02:50 PM) [snapback]348046[/snapback] I think you may have misunderstood my question Shawn. I was asking why Issac's sees the "need" for it, not the consumer. You should be allowed to drink wine, beer or carrot juice with your Mallard if you like just as I am permitted to drink tea with my Eaglet but that isn't the point. Issac's has done so well without alcohol I was just wondering why the powers that be in there corporation want to make a change now... Sorry hope, I'm in the "Why not?" crowd. I think the Blue Heron would be great with a good beer. And fries. I want fries. Please? Oh, more pickled veggies too. I'd buy those by the gallon if I could.And beer by the gallon. What were we talking about again? I'm hungry... QUOTE(Lancaster @ Jan 10 2008, 12:30 PM) [snapback]348008[/snapback] Why don't you just beg for it (the outcry) Gil??? I think Gil was poking fun at the few who are part of the vocal minority: MADD, SADD, RAADD, DAMM. No, not that last one. (Drunks Against MADD Mothers) Kinda like HAGS, Housewives Against Gratuitous Sex. If you weren't aware, that's the organization who rallied for the FCC to fine CBS for Janet Jackson's boob being exposed by another boob. |
| Pericles 1/10/08 4:16 PM | QUOTE(solitary @ Jan 10 2008, 04:39 PM) [snapback]348055[/snapback] I think Gil was poking fun at the few who are part of the vocal minority: MADD, SADD, RAADD, DAMM. Doubtful, but Gil can answer. I suspect that he was "poking fun" at the usual group that he holds in such low regard... the traditional, conservative, Republican, God-fearing Lancaster County natives, you know, the ones with their backwards thinking and aversion to anything new or different. I seriously doubt there will be any outcry, except perhaps from those Harrisburg based advocacy groups. QUOTE(Shawn @ Jan 10 2008, 02:42 PM) [snapback]348028[/snapback] Why is there a "need" for it anywhere? Why is that even a criteria? Why shouldn't I be allowed to drink a glass of wine or have a beer with my Mallard? Later...Shawn Are you talking about a duck? Or am too old or dumb to be down with a new term? Do you have a duck? |
| solitary 1/10/08 4:17 PM | QUOTE(Pericles @ Jan 10 2008, 04:16 PM) [snapback]348066[/snapback] Are you talking about a duck? Or am too old or dumb to be down with a new term? Do you have a duck? |
| Shawn 1/10/08 4:21 PM | QUOTE(Pericles @ Jan 10 2008, 04:16 PM) [snapback]348066[/snapback] Are you talking about a duck? Or am too old or dumb to be down with a new term? Do you have a duck? Nah, thats just the name of my favorite sandwhich at Isaacs. Later...Shawn |
| lanzate 1/10/08 6:53 PM | So what will the gay mennonites think up next? I'll have the kamikaze flamingo. All journalists like an audience so yes, Gil is asking for it. Doesn’t this mean their servers have to be over 21? |
| Alyssarah1 1/10/08 7:23 PM | QUOTE(lanzate @ Jan 10 2008, 07:53 PM) [snapback]348094[/snapback] So what will the gay mennonites think up next? I'll have the kamikaze flamingo. All journalists like an audience so yes, Gil is asking for it. Doesn't this mean their servers have to be over 21? I think they have to be 18 or over. |
| Paul Sweedlepipe 1/10/08 8:05 PM | PA has the most backwards liquor laws in the country |
| citydweller 1/10/08 9:00 PM | "I'll have a finch and a bass". I like the sound of that  |
| BeingReal 1/10/08 9:58 PM | QUOTE(Shawn @ Jan 10 2008, 04:21 PM) [snapback]348070[/snapback] Nah, thats just the name of my favorite sandwhich at Isaacs. Later...Shawn I knew I liked you!  |
| usedmeat 1/10/08 11:21 PM | I'm not sure but I think the sandwiches at Issac's are supposed to be "heart healthy", french fries (freedom fries for the f**ktards) ain't exactly that. Me? I like unsweetened iced tea with my sandwhich but I forget the name of it. I do know they stopped serving one of my faves. Anyway more power to them if they can get a ber and wine license. Hijack alert!!! We used to go to the Panera Bread place on the Fruitville Pike until the missus was reading the resturant inspection column one day. Are they still in business and did they clean up their act? |
| dodgecrew 1/11/08 8:07 AM | QUOTE(usedmeat @ Jan 10 2008, 11:21 PM) [snapback]348138[/snapback] We used to go to the Panera Bread place on the Fruitville Pike until the missus was reading the resturant inspection column one day. Are they still in business and did they clean up their act? My wife reads that every week. It is funny....just about every single place seems to end up with some sort of violation. I wonder how many places out there people would actually eat at, if they could see all of the behind the scenes things that take place......... |
| Lancaster 1/11/08 8:26 AM | QUOTE(dodgecrew @ Jan 11 2008, 09:07 AM) [snapback]348186[/snapback] My wife reads that every week. It is funny....just about every single place seems to end up with some sort of violation. I wonder how many places out there people would actually eat at, if they could see all of the behind the scenes things that take place......... If anybody out there is a cutting board salesman, there is a small fortune out there to be made.... |
| Artie See 1/11/08 8:26 AM | There seems to be a rush to bring liquor licenses into downtown Lancaster. Within the last few years, Annie Bailey's opened, Zimmerman's Family Restaurant was converted into a yuppie bar, a restaurant with a liquor license is supposed to open in Fire Station #5 at Duke and Chestnut, and even the Red Rose Restaurant has applied for a liquor license. An Isaac's employee told us that their landlord - Fulton Bank - was pressuring Isaac's to follow their lead. That's why the owner of Isaac's was intimidated into speaking out publicly in support of the hotel and convention center project. Now Isaac's must compete with all of the other restaurants that serve beer and liquor in downtown Lancaster, which means they also must apply for a liquor license. This is all a part of the "re-inventing" of downtown Lancaster from a family-friendly place for local residents, into the image of what the well-off and politically-connected want Lancaster to become: attractive to tourists and those who are financially well-off. NONE of the changes under way in downtown Lancaster are designed to serve or appeal to the typical Lancaster City resident. |
| Scubabike420 1/11/08 9:07 AM | I agree with Artie. This move by Isaac's is to attract those big city convention goers. So much for regional flair. The changes that the CC will bring to downtown Lancaster will serve to further isolate the city from the rest of the county. I guess it will be nice for county residents to have a local city to prop up with tax dollars along with all the tax dollars we already send down to Philly. |
| Shawn 1/11/08 9:49 AM | QUOTE(Scubabike420 @ Jan 11 2008, 09:07 AM) [snapback]348198[/snapback] I agree with Artie. This move by Isaac's is to attract those big city convention goers. So much for regional flair. The changes that the CC will bring to downtown Lancaster will serve to further isolate the city from the rest of the county. I guess it will be nice for county residents to have a local city to prop up with tax dollars along with all the tax dollars we already send down to Philly. If you were a business owner downtown, wouldn't you want to attract convention goers (assuming there are any)? The convention center is getting built. There will someday, theoritically, be conentions and convention goers. As a business owner, I'd certainly want a piece of that action. As far as "regional flair" goes, I don't think anybody that can't get a drink with their meal considers that kind of "flair" a good thing. Just because the convention center is a bad thing doesn't mean that businesses should for some reason shun convention goers if and when they do start to show up. Later...Shawn |
| solitary 1/11/08 12:26 PM | QUOTE(lanzate @ Jan 10 2008, 06:53 PM) [snapback]348094[/snapback] So what will the gay mennonites think up next? Nope. I'll have the kamikaze flamingo. All journalists like an audience so yes, Gil is asking for it. Doesn't this mean their servers have to be over 21? We have really stupid laws on alcohol, like most of the country. You have to be 21 to drink. 18 to vote and serve alcohol. But only 16 to wash the dishes, where the majority of undrunk wine goes to the dishroom, because up until recently, they patron couldn't bring it home. QUOTE(dodgecrew @ Jan 11 2008, 08:07 AM) [snapback]348186[/snapback] My wife reads that every week. It is funny....just about every single place seems to end up with some sort of violation. I wonder how many places out there people would actually eat at, if they could see all of the behind the scenes things that take place......... Violations are easy to get. Worry more about the serious ones, like using unpasturized eggs, not keeping sanitation stations properly or not checking hamburger temps (automatic failure) and things like that. IIRC, everything else requires multiple violations to fail. |
| Shawn 1/11/08 2:50 PM | QUOTE(Paul Sweedlepipe @ Jan 10 2008, 08:05 PM) [snapback]348104[/snapback] PA has the most backwards liquor laws in the country I think you could even say "in the world". Later...Shawn |
| Artie See 1/11/08 7:54 PM | QUOTE(Scubabike420 @ Jan 11 2008, 09:07 AM) [snapback]348198[/snapback] I agree with Artie. This move by Isaac's is to attract those big city convention goers. So much for regional flair. The changes that the CC will bring to downtown Lancaster will serve to further isolate the city from the rest of the county. I'm more concerned with what is happening to further isolate downtown Lancaster from the rest of the CITY. The re-invention of downtown Lancaster does not reflect the vast majority of people who live in the city.QUOTE(Shawn @ Jan 11 2008, 09:49 AM) [snapback]348209[/snapback] Just because the convention center is a bad thing doesn't mean that businesses should for some reason shun convention goers if and when they do start to show up. I don't think "shunning" convention attendees is the issue. I've both attended and worked at my share of conventions and shows, and I've made more business trips than I can count. When I am visiting a town I'm not familiar with, I go out of my way to look for the LOCAL flavor, as do most of the people I've encountered who travel. IN MY OPINION, re-inventing downtown Lancaster is cheating the vast majority of people who want to see what downtown Lancaster was REALLY like. |
| Shawn 1/11/08 10:45 PM | QUOTE(Artie See @ Jan 11 2008, 07:54 PM) [snapback]348360[/snapback] I don't think "shunning" convention attendees is the issue. I've both attended and worked at my share of conventions and shows, and I've made more business trips than I can count. When I am visiting a town I'm not familiar with, I go out of my way to look for the LOCAL flavor, as do most of the people I've encountered who travel. IN MY OPINION, re-inventing downtown Lancaster is cheating the vast majority of people who want to see what downtown Lancaster was REALLY like. By denying them the opportunity to have a drink with their lunch or dinner? Do you really think conventioneers are going to be specifically seeking out Local Flavor by looking for places that don't serve alcohol? Later...Shawn |
| Lancaster 1/11/08 10:53 PM | still waiting for outcry......   |
| Shawn 1/11/08 11:11 PM | QUOTE(Lancaster @ Jan 11 2008, 10:53 PM) [snapback]348387[/snapback] still waiting for outcry...... It was defeated with a pre-emptive strike. In all seriousness, I think the expected outcry was a result of the reaction a little while back when a chain restaurant in the Manor Shopping center applied for a liquer license. If I remember correctly there was at least some kind of silly unsolicited outcry during that process. Later...Shawn |
| iconoclast 1/12/08 7:52 AM | QUOTE(Artie See @ Jan 11 2008, 09:26 AM) [snapback]348190[/snapback] There seems to be a rush to bring liquor licenses into downtown Lancaster. Within the last few years, Annie Bailey's opened, Zimmerman's Family Restaurant was converted into a yuppie bar, a restaurant with a liquor license is supposed to open in Fire Station #5 at Duke and Chestnut, and even the Red Rose Restaurant has applied for a liquor license. An Isaac's employee told us that their landlord - Fulton Bank - was pressuring Isaac's to follow their lead. That's why the owner of Isaac's was intimidated into speaking out publicly in support of the hotel and convention center project. Now Isaac's must compete with all of the other restaurants that serve beer and liquor in downtown Lancaster, which means they also must apply for a liquor license. This is all a part of the "re-inventing" of downtown Lancaster from a family-friendly place for local residents, into the image of what the well-off and politically-connected want Lancaster to become: attractive to tourists and those who are financially well-off. NONE of the changes under way in downtown Lancaster are designed to serve or appeal to the typical Lancaster City resident. Artie, You have any idea how many "liquor licenses" there were in downtown Lancaster before downtown Lancaster was destroyed? Saturday morning market day (and not just the Central Market) was--for me, as I remember--pretty much a "family-friendly" day. Up to the Northern (or Southern) market--Mom and one or two kids, then over to the Arcadia to meet an uncle or two and have lunch. Then on the way back home stop at the Swan where the granddad might be hanging out after his trip to market. Not disagreeing with you Artie (at least completely), I agree the powers-that-be are remaking the city into their own image as it were, but then, they've been doing that ever since past powers-that-be initially destroyed downtown. And, I agree wholeheartedly; none of the changes (past and present) are (or were) designed to serve or appeal to the "typical Lancaster City resident." But then again, what is the typical Lancaster City resident, in this day and age? Personally, I'm with you (and many others) in that this convention center/hotel thing is probably the final nail in the coffin--as it were--for downtown Lancaster. But then, the a**holes who are driving that bus won't have to pay the fare; the residents of Lancaster (city and county) are going to be thrown under the wheels of that bus in the form of higher taxes and assorted and sundry hidden "service fees." |
