And just who will bring forth articles of impeachment? Those gutless wonder Dems?

Sadly, a good point.



Does it have to play out this way? Must the country watch as an administration that is obviously lying and continues to lie even in the face of the NIE keeps taking us down the path to war? Will the country acquiesce to an attack on Iran knowing, now having virtual proof, that it's not and never has been about nuclear weapons, that we in fact just wanted to attack Iran and we're going to do it no matter what the rationale, no matter what the "proof?"

Let's be careful about what the NIE says and does not say.

The NIE says

1. Iran has a nuclear weapons program
2. Iran stopped this program in 2003

Iran says they never did have and currently do not have a nuclear weapons program.

Even Valerie Plame said Iran was pursuing a nuclear weapons program.

This handling of the NIE indicates to me that something more is going on. Cheney would not give up that easily. Republican pundits are calling for investigations on the handling of the NIE and when Bush knew, and the NeoCons are claiming the intelligence agencies have been infiltrated by Bush haters who released this report to embarrass Bush.

This is far from the end of the story.

The NIE says

1. Iran has a nuclear weapons program
2. Iran stopped this program in 2003

Iran says they never did have and currently do not have a nuclear weapons program.


.

This handling of the NIE indicates to me that something more is going on. Cheney would not give up that easily.

... and the NeoCons are claiming the intelligence agencies have been infiltrated by Bush haters who released this report to embarrass Bush.

poor condi rice is reduced to lamenting that this is proof that democracy works.

Why waste time and effort on impeaching GW Bush? He has just over one year left in office, formal impeachment could take nearly that long.

Because as horrific as impeachment is it is necessary if only to prevent a future president from doing the same as Bush, only with fatal consequences.

If this would work as you say, wouldn't Clinton's impeachment have stopped Bush from doing evil and/or stupid stuff?

Let's be careful about what the NIE says and does not say.

The NIE says

1. Iran has a nuclear weapons program
2. Iran stopped this program in 2003

Iran says they never did have and currently do not have a nuclear weapons program.

Even Valerie Plame said Iran was pursuing a nuclear weapons program.

This handling of the NIE indicates to me that something more is going on. Cheney would not give up that easily. Republican pundits are calling for investigations on the handling of the NIE and when Bush knew, and the NeoCons are claiming the intelligence agencies have been infiltrated by Bush haters who released this report to embarrass Bush.

This is far from the end of the story.

Some interesting questions regarding Dr. Thomas Fingar - July 07:



Consider that on July 11, 2007, roughly four or so months prior to the most recent NIE's publication, Deputy Director of Analysis Thomas Fingar gave the following testimony before the House Armed Services Committee (emphasis added):

Iran and North Korea are the states of most concern to us. The United States' concerns about Iran are shared by many nations, including many of Iran's neighbors. Iran is continuing to pursue uranium enrichment and has shown more interest in protracting negotiations and working to delay and diminish the impact of UNSC sanctions than in reaching an acceptable diplomatic solution. We assess that Tehran is determined to develop nuclear weapons--despite its international obligations and international pressure. This is a grave concern to the other countries in the region whose security would be threatened should Iran acquire nuclear weapons.



The inconsistencies are more troubling when we realize that, according to the Wall Street Journal, Thomas Fingar is one of the three officials who were responsible for crafting the latest NIE. The Journal cites "an intelligence source" as describing Fingar and his two colleagues as "hyper-partisan anti-Bush officials." (The New York Sun drew attention to one of Fingar's colleagues yesterday.)



http://www.weeklystandard.com/weblogs/TWSF...t_aboutface.asp



Another case of lefty piggy soros media shoot from the hip that will fall flat again? Gil? Fingars testimony was July '07.

oh by the way...where the helll are all the christians who were pumping a noo-cue-ler attack on iran based on what we now know were bold faced lies by their little lord and saviour george jr?
yeah you folks have lots of credibilty.LOL

do you even have the decency to be ashamed of yourselves?
can you now see why the war in iraq was also based on lies?
can you see what happens when you let a twerp like bush supplant jesus as your lord and saviour?
bush ain't gonna save you fools from nuthin'.
LOL
what a zoo.

uhhh hey art ...the problem is that your kid bush jr was caught lying yet again and you try to change the subject.

at what point do you as an american , say enough lies?
making excuses for jr makes you look like some stooge.

Another case of lefty piggy soros media shoot from the hip that will fall flat again?

does israel have a nuclear weapons program or nuclear weapons? have they admitted to it? are they signitors to the nuclear non-proliferation treaty?

I am just telling you about the BS that is out there. Stop eating it up for one day.

And I don't think I'm nearly alone in that regard.

Doesn't that kind of simplify the discussion? Do you trust insert politician's name as much as you trust your dog?

This is the core of America's cancer - it's not just that BushCo has lied, lies now and will certainly lie again. It's that the people working so hard to expose the lies are themselves lying liars, with no less ambition for power and no more respect for the people of this country than the current regime.

The entire political spectrum in America is rotten. You can argue all day long about Cheyney's evil agenda versus Billary's social security agenda versus Ohmama's foreign relations agenda versus Huckabee's (sorry, sounds funny enough) creationist agenda versus Giuliani's preferred breast size....

.... and they just keep shoveling the shinola onto your plate so you can keep arguing, and keep from paying real attention to the broader picture. It's practically scripted, like a sick "Who's on first?" with expletives added, and it's all geared to keep you from recognizing one simple fact.

They're all really more-or-less alike, and they all really have the same agenda: Power.

- and as I've said before, I really believe that we have to actually go over the cliff before anything can possibly change.

I hate to say this City but you are so right. There is not a politician out there that I trust. Our country is in bad shape and I don't see anyone out there that can get it back in shape. Sad, sad state of affairs.

No. This is nothing more than just another typical case of when GW Bush's supporters don't like the message, they attack the messenger.

This has happened far too many times to be counted easily.

Do you trust Rick Gray as much as you trust your dog?

Do you trust Mike Sturla as much as you trust your dog?

Do you trust Gib Armstrong as much as you trust your dog?

Do you trust Carol Simpson as much as you trust your dog?

Talk about changing the subject!

How is "Bush lying yet again"



I only pointed out that it appears that there are major questions regarding the reporting of the authors and what they found. No surprise there!

So, Joe here we go again - can you explain why there has been a change in the "reporting" of nuclear research and activity in Iran since July? Do you have any reasons or explanations as to why Dr Fingars whould do an about face? try to do this without making false accusations about me trying to cover for Bush. I am just telling you about the BS that is out there. Stop eating it up for one day.One day only!



Try listening for a change!

Yes, yes, we've had our 5 minute ashamed of ourselves session, and have moved on. It's time you did too.

Artie - Can you explain the reasons for the NIE flip flop on the inteligence reporting?

Is it totally out of the realm of possibilities that it is political?

art you dissapoint me.LOL

uhhh pay attention art. the intel chief told the boy back in august that there was a major change in the assessment of whether iran had a noo-cue-ler weapons program.

bush then claimed that he did not ask what that change was, and he kept on pumping war. now art do you believe that when bush was told this by the intel chief that bush said nothing?didn't ask a question?

either bush was lying or he is guilty of dereliction of duty.

now art...does bush have a reputation for lying?think iraq war art. think weapons of mass destruction art. think yellow cake art.

of course if you think he is derelict there are remedies in the constitution, which, hello art, is the subject of this thread.

art if bush bombed iran and it turned out he knew this but bombed anyway would you still be making excuses for him?

i think you would.







wow 5 minutes of shame for almost bombing iran and killing god knows how many people based on more lies by our "christian" president.

man that is truly humble.LOL

why do i get the feeling that bush is pistoff that the truth came out and he can't murder more innocents?







did it occur to you that they have spies on the ground , in iran and that they had this info for awhile but didn't let on because it may expose an intelligence operation?

yeah valerie plame was working on this very thing and she was outed but god knows that wasn't bush's fault.

what a coincidence, plame was outed while working on iran's wmd situation.

yeah art the entire intelligence community is lying because they hate our freedoms.

good grief.

So...Joe - which version of the disinformation is convenient for you to believe in?

You have no clue how intelligence was gathered. In your world, do you trust the Iranians? So, we should impeach Bush, and let Iraq do what they please?

Don't tell me, you believe the UN will solve the issues here.