The war on the middle class
October 10th, 2007 2:31 pm · 27 comments
The right wants to make war on the Frost family? Bring ‘em on, writes Colin McEnroe of the Hartford Courant:
If you boil away all the vitriol, what you’re left with is a conservative argument that goes like this: These people — even with their combined income of a VERY modest $45,000 — have no business turning to the government for help with their medical bills because they haven’t been bankrupted yet. They’re income is low, but they’ve managed to hang onto some assets that place them a little closer to the middle class. It’s disgusting that they get help from the government if they have anything.
<snip>
If the Democrats were smart, they’d keep this conversation going, because the Frosts seem to be exactly whom we should be talking about. They’re trying to make it as a middle class family, without a lot of income. And they’re just about succeeding, as long Malkin and her friends don’t insist that they be bankrupted or stripped of their hard-won assets by their medical bills.
Medical bills are the number one cause of bankruptcy in this nation. When people are telling you how much better our system is than those of Germany, France, Australia, Canada, be sure to point that out. In our system, you could lose your job tomorrow, lose your health insurance in the same gulp and immediately become one bad illness or accident away from bankruptcy (although, in fact, our system regularly bankrupts even the people who think they do have coverage, as the Harvard Study illustrates).
And look at this! Malkin and her friends don’t want to fix that problem. On the contrary, they insist on it! They insist on the risk of bankruptcy as kind of a moral imperative; and they say members of the shaky, eroding American middle class who are not willing to put up with the ruination of their financial health from medical bills are leeches and wussies! Wow.
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Tags: Health care
There are currently 27 comments on this blog postView Topic | Comment on this blogace1969 10/10/07 3:10 PM | Now hear is something I agree with. The middle class is getting the short end of the stick again. While I am in no way supportive of a socialist version of health care I do believe that something needs to be done. I am sick (no pun intended) of paying over $2,400.00 / year for my insurance on a plan w/ a $5,000.00 family deductible! I am tied of having to demand that our Doctors code whatever we have done a certain way in the hopes that my insurance will cover it.
Most of all I am sick and tired of people with kids by multiple Fathers/Mothers, not being married, come and go to work as they please. Than go to the Doctor and have there Doctor tell them there kids have ADD/ADHD or some other crap that I believe is all a figment of there imagination!!!!
I have helped people like this do there taxes and get $7,000+ back when they do not even work and I play more than that into taxes! Than they have the guts to apply for Government medical assistance.
The rich get screwed on percentages, the working poor get no help to entice them to work, the middle class has to give in at every turn of a corner. Then the "lazy" poor sit on there butts watching daytime TV!
Ok, I feel a little better now. Back to work.
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palmer 10/10/07 10:25 PM | QUOTE I have helped people like this do there taxes and get $7,000+ back when they do not even work and I play more than that into taxes! Than they have the guts to apply for Government medical assistance.
They are not getting $7,000 "back". They are getting a subsidy from the government. Probably EIC and other child and/or disability credits.
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ace1969 10/11/07 8:18 AM | Your are correct. Almost no income and 4 kids to claim. Walking Pez-Dispenser spitting out kids and we pay for it.
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grieker 10/11/07 8:33 AM | "Mothers in British Columbia are having a baby boom, but it's the United States that has to deliver, and that has some proud Canadians blasting their highly touted government healthcare system."
So tell me again how our health care system is worse than Canada?
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ace1969 10/11/07 8:50 AM | From my POV it is a cost/quality issue. I do believe that we should be able to choose our own providers. Those that we feel offer the best service to fit our individual needs. A more socialistic plan, where all are paid the same regardless of quality, tends to lead to providers who become complaisant. This due to the, "why do better if you just get the same attitude". However, the plan is broken. Insurance providers force us to lessen our options in order to control cost. I do not want to go to Wal-Mart to have my eyes checked let alone having my Prostate checked in the same place I can by motor oil and underwear.
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justplainjoe 10/11/07 9:05 AM | it what you get for yer tax dollars folks. we get a failed war in iraq among other things.
that's what ya get when you elect yer preznit based on who you would rather have a beer with instead of who is more capable and competent. sure an ex-alkie would be more fun to get drunk with but what would he do with unlimited power? sadly we found out and it ain't pretty.
so the next time you think jr is the best preznit ever think about this..steve schwartzman, ceo of private equity firm blackstone recently sold $677,000,000 in stock of his own company and will pay 15% capital gains tax.
while the suckers pay how much?
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/07/11/business...agewanted=print
http://www.crosscut.com/flip-side/5194/The...down+on+us+all/
who said we pay 50% in taxes? |
hahaha 10/11/07 9:11 AM | I said it. Add it up, if you know math which obviously you don't because the last time I checked, every single America pays the same 15% rate on capital gains. Then again, why do facts matter when joe is trying to bust on rich people? |
dodgecrew 10/11/07 9:18 AM | QUOTE(hahaha @ Oct 11 2007, 09:11 AM) [snapback]327944[/snapback] I said it. Add it up, if you know math which obviously you don't because the last time I checked, every single America pays the same 15% rate on capital gains. Then again, why do facts matter when joe is trying to bust on rich people? I think that a broken record sounds fitting........ |
justplainjoe 10/11/07 9:19 AM | QUOTE(hahaha @ Oct 11 2007, 09:11 AM) [snapback]327944[/snapback] I said it. Add it up, if you know math which obviously you don't because the last time I checked, every single America pays the same 15% rate on capital gains. Then again, why do facts matter when joe is trying to bust on rich people?
son...the rich get their income from capital gains so they pay 15% income tax while everyone else pays more.
now if that is okay with you fine but it is a fact .
so tell all the working stiffs again why they should pay 50% for a war we are losing and no health benefits while the rich pay 15% ???
make all the excuses you want but the rich ain't paying their fair share and only an idiot or a rich guy would argue with that.
which are you?LOL
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dodgecrew 10/11/07 9:25 AM | QUOTE(justplainjoe @ Oct 11 2007, 09:19 AM) [snapback]327950[/snapback] son...the rich get their income from capital gains so they pay 15% income tax while everyone else pays more. now if that is okay with you fine but it is a fact . so tell all the working stiffs again why they should pay 50% for a war we are losing and no health benefits while the rich pay 15% ??? make all the excuses you want but the rich ain't paying their fair share and only an idiot or a rich guy would argue with that. which are you? Now this is the Joe that I know. Turn every thread into a "I hate Bush" thread. Some things never change........... |
johnq 10/11/07 9:28 AM | I have a great idea. I'll work hard, invest wisely in real estate, stocks and bonds, and become rich. Then I won't have to worry about all this stuff the rest of you pissants do.  |
ace1969 10/11/07 9:30 AM | The tax rates that apply to net capital gain are generally lower than the tax rates that apply to other income and are called the maximum capital gains rates. For 2006, the maximum capital gains rates are 5%, 15%, 25% or 28%. Joe, post a copy of your 711 license than we will talk.
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hahaha 10/11/07 9:44 AM | QUOTE so tell all the working stiffs again why they should pay 50% for a war we are losing and no health benefits while the rich pay 15% ? Isn't it great to use percentages!?! Tell the rich people that pay millions of dollars per year in taxes while the working stiffs get $7000 in tax credits and had $9000 withheld from their paycheck. |
grieker 10/11/07 9:55 AM | QUOTE(justplainjoe @ Oct 11 2007, 08:19 AM) [snapback]327950[/snapback]
son...the rich get their income from capital gains so they pay 15% income tax while everyone else pays more.
now if that is okay with you fine but it is a fact .
so tell all the working stiffs again why they should pay 50% for a war we are losing and no health benefits while the rich pay 15% ???
make all the excuses you want but the rich ain't paying their fair share and only an idiot or a rich guy would argue with that. which are you?LOL
Losing the war? Have we had another attack on our soil that I don't know about? I mean violent attack, not like what is happening at the Empire State building turning green, or public schools allotting time for Muslim prayer. I'm talking about a physical attack.
No! We haven't Joe.
Get your facts straight before you spew forth partial truths.
Oh I think I just found out what has your panties in a bunch, the Britts said that your buddy's book (Gore) isn't factual. That's it. Now I think I understand, I'll try and be more compassionate with you Josey.
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Lysol54 10/11/07 10:09 AM | QUOTE(grieker @ Oct 11 2007, 09:55 AM) [snapback]327967[/snapback]
Losing the war? Have we had another attack on our soil that I don't know about? I mean violent attack, not like what is happening at the Empire State building turning green, or public schools allotting time for Muslim prayer. I'm talking about a physical attack.
No! We haven't Joe.
Get your facts straight before you spew forth partial truths.
Oh I think I just found out what has your panties in a bunch, the Britts said that your buddy's book (Gore) isn't factual. That's it. Now I think I understand, I'll try and be more compassionate with you Josey.
Hey Grieker give it time, theres still another year till the next election. something tells me theres still time. Funny how we get those "alerts" at the most opertune times. Funny how this administration can't handle the 3 wars its got going right now and is trying to rattle the sabers to start a 4th? Yeah that makes perfect sense doesn't it. just enough time for them to leave office, join back with Haliburton and all those wonderful companies and just roll in the spoils of war. They can't handle what they have going right now and want to pick more fights? Then we sit back and wonder why people would want to attack us? Give me a break
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justplainjoe 10/11/07 10:23 AM | QUOTE(dodgecrew @ Oct 11 2007, 09:25 AM) [snapback]327954[/snapback] Now this is the Joe that I know. Turn every thread into a "I hate Bush" thread. Some things never change...........
dodger ...read the title again son. it is about fairness. i suppose you think it's fair for the rich to write off their income as capital gains and pay less than you but then that is what makeds you a republican.
they just loves guys like you.LOL
by the way... i pay a far smaller % of my income than you do.
QUOTE(grieker @ Oct 11 2007, 09:55 AM) [snapback]327967[/snapback]
Losing the war? Have we had another attack on our soil that I don't know about? I mean violent attack, not like what is happening at the Empire State building turning green, or public schools allotting time for Muslim prayer. I'm talking about a physical attack.
No! We haven't Joe.
Get your facts straight before you spew forth partial truths.
Oh I think I just found out what has your panties in a bunch, the Britts said that your buddy's book (Gore) isn't factual. That's it. Now I think I understand, I'll try and be more compassionate with you Josey.
we are losing the war in iraq becuase the idiots did not send in enough troops. that is from american generals so go look it up before you rant about being in the military and poor you were yelled at 30 years ago by hippies.
oh wait you are from lancaster so you know more than colin powell and other generals.LOL
QUOTE(hahaha @ Oct 11 2007, 09:44 AM) [snapback]327961[/snapback] Isn't it great to use percentages!?! Tell the rich people that pay millions of dollars per year in taxes while the working stiffs get $7000 in tax credits and had $9000 withheld from their paycheck.
from the guy who claimed we all pay 50% of our income in taxes.LOL
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hahaha 10/11/07 10:34 AM | Yeah I said ALL. No, just those hard working chumps like your employees so you can sit around and play on the computer and pay a far less % of your income then them. |
dodgecrew 10/11/07 10:46 AM | QUOTE(justplainjoe @ Oct 11 2007, 10:23 AM) [snapback]327975[/snapback] by the way... i pay a far smaller % of my income than you do. Another thing that you know very little about......... |
justplainjoe 10/11/07 11:43 AM | QUOTE(dodgecrew @ Oct 11 2007, 09:25 AM) [snapback]327954[/snapback] Now this is the Joe that I know. Turn every thread into a "I hate Bush" thread. Some things never change...........
dodger where is jr boy even mentioned in that thread?is bearing false witness accidently still a sin?LOL
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dodgecrew 10/11/07 11:47 AM | QUOTE(justplainjoe @ Oct 11 2007, 11:43 AM) [snapback]328026[/snapback] dodger where is jr boy even mentioned in that thread?is bearing false witness accidently still a sin? Bush....war.....these are your spews........ |
justplainjoe 10/11/07 12:11 PM | QUOTE(dodgecrew @ Oct 11 2007, 11:47 AM) [snapback]328028[/snapback] Bush....war.....these are your spews........
sure any criticism is dismissed as a spew.
and jr didn't start the war so it's not his fault.
and he never mocked christians either.LOL
you are so provincial, dodger.LOL
very quaint ideas(?). the ol' "you hate bush" and "you hate america" comebacks.LOL |
dodgecrew 10/11/07 12:24 PM | QUOTE(justplainjoe @ Oct 11 2007, 12:11 PM) [snapback]328040[/snapback] sure any criticism is dismissed as a spew. and jr didn't start the war so it's not his fault. and he never mocked christians either.LOL you are so provincial, dodger.LOL very quaint ideas(?). the ol' "you hate bush" and "you hate america" comebacks.LOL Honestly, Joe, I am wondering if you took one to many pills this morning. Tell you what......we can make this really easy for you. Do a word search......"bush". I am willing to bet that you have four times the amounts of hits than I do. Since you have roughly twice the amount of posts, this would be double the amount of times that you used it....... |
johnq 10/11/07 3:53 PM | QUOTE(dodgecrew @ Oct 11 2007, 12:24 PM) [snapback]328046[/snapback] Honestly, Joe, I am wondering if you took one to many pills this morning. Tell you what......we can make this really easy for you. Do a word search......"bush". I am willing to bet that you have four times the amounts of hits than I do. Since you have roughly twice the amount of posts, this would be double the amount of times that you used it....... Oh dodger, it's your king george that's the pill popper remember?LOL
or is it an alky, I can't keep up with all his drug use.LOL
must be why he lies so much, he can't even remember what the truth is.LOL
don't worry, dodger, yer jesus will forgive your sins.LOL
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grieker 10/11/07 3:55 PM | QUOTE(johnq @ Oct 11 2007, 02:53 PM) [snapback]328120[/snapback] Oh dodger, it's your king george that's the pill popper remember?LOL
or is it an alky, I can't keep up with all his drug use.LOL
must be why he lies so much, he can't even remember what the truth is.LOL
don't worry, dodger, yer jesus will forgive your sins.LOL
What the heck did you do Johnny? Smoke your lunch!
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lanzate 10/11/07 5:16 PM | Gil,
Sorry for the over used cliché but money still does not grow on trees. If you think the middle class is being financially assaulted, where is help going to come from? The only thing wrong with the government giving the middle class cheap health insurance is that they are making the lower class finance it.
It is kind of a toss-up for me how much we should tax nicotine but I still think there is some fuzzy math going on when a few cents more on cigarettes is going to put a dent in government health insurance. There is going to be tax money needed as well and then if we are going to be tax more are we any farther ahead.
A middle class welfare state just smells a lot like communism, not that is bad or anything. History just tells us that it doesn’t work for long. Government should be there for the needy, but somehow we have redefined who is needy.
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justplainjoe 10/11/07 5:50 PM | QUOTE(johnq @ Oct 11 2007, 03:53 PM) [snapback]328120[/snapback] Oh dodger, it's your king george that's the pill popper remember?LOL
or is it an alky, I can't keep up with all his drug use.LOL
must be why he lies so much, he can't even remember what the truth is.LOL
don't worry, dodger, yer jesus will forgive your sins.LOL
hey john you need to label it sarcasm or folks will think you finally came to yer senses .LOL
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Artie See 10/11/07 10:31 PM | QUOTE(lanzate @ Oct 11 2007, 05:16 PM) [snapback]328135[/snapback] A middle class welfare state just smells a lot like communism, not that is bad or anything. The idea is NOT communism. The real idea is for U.S. citizens to share our health care risks, while cutting out the wasteful insurance company overhead.
Yes, there would be tax increases if a single-payer health care system were enacted. But you can take it to the bank that the amount of tax and fees you would pay for a single-payer health care system will be far less than what you would pay for a combination of insurance premiums, copays, and deductibles.
QUOTE(http://www.consumeraffairs.com/news04/2005/bankruptcy_study.html) "The paradox is that the costliest health system in the world performs so poorly. We waste one-third of every health care dollar on insurance bureaucracy and profits while two million people go bankrupt annually and we leave 45 million uninsured" said Dr. Quentin Young, national coordinator of Physicians for a National Health Program. |
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